"other" boards

Again I bring up "other" boards, cuz something is bugging me. We have these boards cuz of what we have in common - Christianity first and music second. I've been frequenting another board for a few months now and I see several non-believers come and go... which is not a problem, unbelievers are more than welcome.
But honestly, if you're an unbeliever and you start chatting on boards with titles like "CHRISTIAN Hard Music", or "CHRISTIAN Metal Realm"... what do you expect but to hear talk about the Christian faith ?? I think it's healthy for unbelievers to ask questions and even challenge believers, but if their mind is already made up (as is ours), then don't bother ! Right ?

I think what gets me is 2 things:
1. Why do unbelievers get all ruffled when they're on sites DEDICATED to Christianity ?
2. Why do they try so hard to change us, and why do we try so hard to change them ? That's NOT the Great Commision. We are merely to present truth and if someone rejects truth... let 'em reject it and move on. If someone's chosen, they will respond to the simple Gospel at the time it's presented or later down the road when they decide to quit fighting it. But nobody's been converted cuz we kept beating someone who's mind is already made up.

Am I wrong here ? I'd like to hear your input - cuz unlike some I've seen on "other" boards, I listen to people's opinions and consider them.

Another quick thought - to me it's like going to someone's house and telling them how much you don't like their furniture or how the house is arranged.

They would tell me "um, yea... why don't you leave !?"

I was mid way through writing a longish reply, and realised as I went along that not a lot of it made any sense what so ever!!!!

So, the basic answer is... I don't know!

(sorry!)



Fundy

I think there are several reasons why non-Christians would join a "Christian" site. And many of them might be benign (or harmless). But I believe several of them do it just to debate, attack, ridicule, or other-wise stir up trouble.

The internet provides a level of anonymity that for some reason allows people to behave much worse then if they had to deal with others face to face.

I completely understand why a Christian would "want to change the mind" of an unbeliever. Primarily because the Christian doesn't want to see others suffer an eternity in hell. Of course how someone goes about that can be completely up to debate. What I do not understand are Athiests who insist on "disproving" God to Christians. What for? What's the point? If they truly believe there is no God why would they care if anyone believes in what they think is a myth? Especially since they have absolutely nothing better to offer?

Often times I am remind of a line in Hamlet "Me thinks the lady doth protest too much". I often think the reason that Athiests need the rest of the world to doubt God is so they can have some assurance in their "unbelief". If everyone else denies God maybe they won't feel so much guilt for hating God......just a thought that often rattles through my otherwise empty brain.

Very good stuff ! Thank you for that Gar.

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What I do not understand are Athiests who insist on "disproving" God to Christians. What for? What's the point? If they truly believe there is no God why would they care if anyone believes in what they think is a myth? Especially since they have absolutely nothing better to offer?

My feelings EXACTLY.

And I also agree that I don't want to see anyone suffer an eternity without God, but the more I read Scripture, the more I come to understand that it's not our job to save people. We present the Gospel in love, answer any sincere questions they may have, and if they're chosen, they'll accept the Truth at some point in time. NOT by us bantering and arguing - No one gets argued into heaven.
Again, I could be wrong on this, it's just how I see things as well as the overwhelming amount of Scripture on the Chosen.

I knew several non-Christians at the CMR who were quite benign, and others who were a bit less benign.

It can be very difficult to spread the Gospel in love…

G/F, I'm with you. As a regular participant on some "other" board that has recently seen this happen, I have no sympathy for those people. It's like my nephew who signed up in college as a music major (voice) and then complained about having to take voice lessons and sing on recitals. What did he think was going to happen? I have a few friends who are atheists and agnostics and are not militant or evangelistic about it. They don't believe in God, they know I do, we talk sports and music and direct conversations about God rarely come up. When they do it is because they want to know my perspective as a Christian (which rarely lines up with what is perceived as the Christian CW) and I tell them how I believe. It is a little thing we call "mutual respect." You are absolutely right that no one gets argued into heaven, so I don't bother. I show them Christ through other ways and I pray constantly that he will break through their disbelief, but again, I don't try to force it. I once wrote that I think a lot of Christians try to usurp the position of the Holy Spirit by making themselves the ones who will judge the world of sin and righteousness, and I think this is another area where they do it: by making someone being saved all about them. As to why both sides go back and forth trying to prove the other people wrong, I think a lot of it comes down to winning. We like to win and we like to be right.

I am afraid if I go on any longer I will need to delete a post I made on that "other" board. Plus I don't want to get the "elect vs. free-will" machine cranked up over here.

I agree with everyone so far, but I also wanted to add, I really think that SOME non believers that join the Christian Boards do it just to have someone to fuss at or argue with. I think that we need do pay attention to these people & if this is someone who does this often, we need to know when there is no point. Don't give them what they want (a heated debate when their mind is set in stone)

people paint atheists and christians alike as people who like to argue and I don't think, by and large, that either like to argue any more than any other groups of people. Both simply tend to be very impassioned about their perspective.

personally, when I was an atheist, I used to hang around in christian chat rooms and such... partly because having been a christian, most of my online friends were christians or were in the christian chat rooms... it was partly a "normal" thing... it was not always about starting an argument.

People who like to debate and discuss need to have that balanced with discretion as to what is appropriate and when and where. Arguing for the sake of arguing, or debating just to toute your own "intellectual superiority" or the "inherent lack thereof of those who disagree" then you simply have no discretion and will always cause more damage than wisdom imparted.

Personally, I love debating/discussing. I learn better through that then I do almost anything else. I even debate things within myself to understand things deeper. There comes a point, however, where you have to learn how to settle yourself on a point. If you live life only by intellectualism you will NEVER have peace and you will never have an answer. Absolute skepticism is absolute stupidity.

Guilty/Forgiven wrote:

... but the more I read Scripture, the more I come to understand that it's not our job to save people. We present the Gospel in love, answer any sincere questions they may have, and if they're chosen, they'll accept the Truth at some point in time. NOT by us bantering and arguing - No one gets argued into heaven.

I completely agree that it is the work of the Holy Spirit to convict the unsaved that they need Christ, and nothing any of us can do or say will "save" anyone. I also seriously doubt that anyone ever gets argued into heaven (I've never seen it, and I've seen several people try...lol).

I did question one on-line poster why he so vehemently (but actually politely) debated with atheists on-line....when it was quite obvious they had absolutely no intention of surrendering their will to Christ. He stated that his posts were similar to print material (like tract's or pamphlets) that clearly laid out the gospel message of salvation, and that someone coming along a few weeks or even months later would be exposed to the gospel by reading the post. In his case I thought this very apt. He was a very polite person that never seemed to loose his temper and lash out angrily against verbal attacks from others. So his behavior also pointed to Christ. Sadly I could not join him, because I was apt to get angry and say something completely stupid and spoil my witness for Christ (like most of us seem to do when we debate with those who deny Christ)

messiaen77 wrote:

I am afraid if I go on any longer I will need to delete a post I made on that "other" board. Plus I don't want to get the "elect vs. free-will" machine cranked up over here.

No worries, debate tends to be unpopular on this board, and arguing is never tolerated.....

Readi Sketti wrote:

..... I think that we need do pay
attention to these people & if this is someone who does this often,
we need to know when there is no point. Don't give them what they want
(a heated debate when their mind is set in stone)

Brings to mind something Jesus said (in Matthew) about not casting our pearls before swine. Good advice, I agree.

unworthy wrote:

personally, when I was an atheist, I used to hang around in christian
chat rooms and such... partly because having been a christian, most of
my online friends were christians or were in the christian chat rooms...
it was partly a "normal" thing... it was not always about starting an
argument.

That seems completely reasonable to me. And when I was an atheist (probably actually more of an agnostic), I could care less what anyone believed, and I couldn't understand why anyone would insist that their religious belief (or lack there of) had to be shared by everyone.

of course... I was not always of good intention... though I preferred to be calm and civil... and laugh to myself when I tripped Christians up... I hope none of the stuff I did caused anyone to question their faith... I already have enough blood on my hands.

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Sadly I could not join him, because I was apt to get angry and say something completely stupid and spoil my witness for Christ

That was me for quite some time, I know how you feel. Nowadays, I don't get into heated discussions cuz I don't see the point in them. I may be wrong in how I feel on this, but I've adopted a live-and-let-live attitude (rather live and let die). It's NOT that I don't care, or want to see anyone perish - but in the past I've exhausted myself arguing with someone who had clearly made up their mind, only to just get frustrated. God himself has said that some have blinded, veiled eyes so that they cannot see (the Jews are in this context, but I believe that this extends to those who will never accept Jesus - those who are not chosen, [many are called but few are chosen]). When I share what Jesus has done for me and His plan of salvation, I let God do the work. If I'm ridiculed or ignored, I "shake off the dust" (as He told his disciples) and I leave the seed alone with a hope and a prayer that it will take root sometime later. I don't keep on bantering so that the seed will be forced to take root.

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I already have enough blood on my hands

Be careful how much meaning you pour into that passage/concept. It is possible for a person to have blood on their hands, but anything we did before we became Children of God, doesn't count against us. Anything we do after, we're forgiven if we are repentant and asked His forgiveness. If not for His Grace toward me, I would have LOTS of blood on my hands. And if not for accepting His forgiveness, I would be ineffective as His child cuz I'd spend a lot of time in regret for the bad decisions I've made.

I think you mistook my intention and the context of what I meant by that. I was not saying that the blood on my hands has stained my heart above what the Blood of Christ was able to clean or that I am guilty (or feel guilty) for what I have done in the past or even the sins I do now.

Oh oh oh, I gotcha. Sorry bout that. I understand. I just didn't want to see you beating yourself for something Jesus already took care of. Love you brother !

any guilt I feel is self-imposed and only to accomplish greater surrender.. like how Isaiah felt when He saw God.. "I am a man of unclean lips" .. the more you see of the greatness and purity of God.. the easier it is to see your own sin.

My thoughts about this are.

Some people join christian forums only to be a troublemaker.

Other people who join will feel like they are lost in a maze because they have no idea where we are talking about. They can't see see who Jesus for them can be.

About troublemakers we have to be clear accept the rules of the christian forums, if not leave or ban them.

For those who are searching who Jesus is we have to be patient and help them to find the way to Jesus.

Amen and amen !

rockerVu2 wrote:

My thoughts about this are.

Some people join christian forums only to be a troublemaker.

Other people who join will feel like they are lost in a maze because they have no idea where we are talking about. They can't see see who Jesus for them can be.

About troublemakers we have to be clear accept the rules of the christian forums, if not leave or ban them.

For those who are searching who Jesus is we have to be patient and help them to find the way to Jesus.

Agreed

When people try to start a fight with (for example) me, it's hard to answer their questions when they're super aggressive about it. I try to let them know that I'm not interested in taking on their non-curious questions, but they see that as a sign of weakness.

Related to this, regarding trolls…
Psalm 70 2b-3:
May all who desire my ruin
be turned back in disgrace.
May those who say to me, “Aha! Aha!”
turn back because of their shame.

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No worries, debate tends to be unpopular on this board, and arguing is never tolerated..

This is why this is the only Christian board I am on. One can express their thoughts and just move on.

yeah.. I can say "you know how I feel about that bt" and just move on..

unless we wanted a 15 page thread on Predestination and Free will lol

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unless we wanted a 15 page thread on Predestination and Free will lol

"you know how I feel about that unworthy" ..I have said all I want to say on that subject..LOL